Across the Table - Changing Childhoods, an evaluation of the accelerated maturation of children

Jordan Anderson, Marcus Kim, Suhani Mahajan, Orelia Thottam, Delisa Troupe

Hosts Jordan Anderson, Orelia Thottam, Marcus Kim, and Suhani Mahajan discuss the shift from their childhood experiences to the ones they observe around themselves today. Listen on Spotify or Apple Music.

Suhani: Hello, and welcome to Point of View where we give students a place to listen, learn and lean in. We're your hosts Suhani,

Marcus: Marcus,

Jordan: Jordan,

Orelia: Orelia.

Suhani: And lately, we've been thinking about how we see kids and mind you, these are like middle school aged kids, that we realize they seem a lot more mature or appear a lot more mature, then we remember being at that age, and we wanted to talk about them more and actually share our observations.

Marcus: So if we're going to go off observations, in my neighborhood, there are a couple of middle school kids, right. And mind you, I was kind of a nerdier kid back in middle school. So of course, I wasn't as social in middle school as maybe some of the middle schoolers I'm looking at now. However, you know, sometimes on Friday nights, when I'm hanging out with my friends, and we get home at around, I don't know, 10:30, I see these middle schoolers out with their skateboards and their phones. And I could definitely see them passing as kids my age, I'm not sure. It's just how they carry themselves, what they do, the way they interact with their peers, and just some of the things that they say and do just make me question, “Oh, my gosh, these guys are like four years younger than me.”

Suhani: You kind of forget that too, because this weekend, I hung out with my sister's friends and when I was talking to them, it didn't feel like I was talking to you know, significantly younger children until I reminded myself, “Wait, some of these topics aren't really things that they should be or that I remember talking about when I was their age”. Like they're talking about really intimate relationships and they're, you know, bad mouthing some kids or you know, just like gossip, but this kind of gossip, at least I wasn't exposed to until like high school, and not until the later years.

Jordan: Whenever I see middle schoolers, I always compare how they're acting from when I was in middle school. When I was in middle school, I was weird. I was really weird and closed off. I was like a gremlin. But then when I see other kids that age, and they're acting like how I act now, I always find it interesting how we were the same age. Like they're 12, their 12-year-old lives compared to mine. I was like, more kid-ish. But now they act like I act as a 16-year-old. And I'm just like, “Okay, what are you doing differently that I didn't do? Or what did I do that you didn't do?” You know?

Orelia: It's also like, when I was in middle school I was in India. But when I was in middle school, the way we used to have fun, the way we used to hang out with our friends, and the way our school life was. When I see kids over here, when I see middle school kids, I’m friends with a few middle schoolers and I speak to them, and the way they tend to hang out or the way they spend their time, as in leisure time, it's just different. Like, it's similar to what I do with my friends now. Like, if it's going out at night, hanging out in the mall at night, and then coming back home or something like that. They're doing that stuff now, when I didn't have permission to do any of that stuff back then.

Marcus: I mean, of course, and this is all from the perspective of a semi-affluent suburban life, right? Like, of course, it would be different if we were to look at maybe like, you know, a richer area city or even like a more poor area of accounting or such, but seeing these kids grow up in similar environments as us, it just makes you start to question like, why is this generation suddenly more socially mature than I was? Right? And I think, to kind of, you know, point a finger, I would kind of say, I think it's because of the amount of exposure that they have to social media, right and just technology. Because, you know, with technology, information can be diffused, right. Like, with social media and technology, you know, like gossip and information, or maybe more adulterated content that, you know, some kids shouldn't be exposed to at such young ages happen to kind of come across their radar. And I don't think it's exactly a bad thing that younger generations are, you know, getting iPhones and iPads at earlier ages, but it's just something that us as a generation, like our older generation have to kind of look back and say, “Okay, well, how is this different from us? What can we learn? How can we guide them in a way?” I'm not really sure, but it's definitely the technology and social media that, I would say, is propelling younger kids forward a bit more.

Jordan: Like I can see kids having a phone for maybe security purposes and like when they go out so that they have contact with their family. But then I see 10-year-olds and 11-year-olds having Instagram, Snapchat, and I didn't get social media until seventh grade and even when I did, I was only following my family and only my family could see. And I didn't really show any other people because my family was like, “Oh no, that's your personal thing.” But now my sister's friends try to follow me on Instagram and it's weird because they're little babies in my mind. Even though we're not that big of an age difference, only four years, but they would do things and post certain things and I'm really questioning their thought process and why they're saying those types of things or like, why they're looking at that type of stuff, or acting like it.

Marcus: Like bro, you're like 12, chill. What do you have to do on Instagram? Like go and play hopscotch man. What are you doing on Instagram and Snapchat? Like, actually, what are you doing on Instagram and Snapchat? It's very easy to look at it very pessimistically like “Oh, this younger generation is being ruined by technology”, which is kind of hypocritical because we, you know, the older kids by half a decade or so, we also grew up with technology. But it's very easy to slip into that mindset of “Oh, wow, these younger kids are being ruined by technology.” So it's definitely a slippery slope.

Suhani: Well, I'm not trying to blame but I think what you were talking about, the exposure through social media being the propellant of this, you know, expediting maturity, is that the same things that we are seeing at our age, the clothing trends, the ideas, like, you know, how we hang out, if that's being posted on social media, and younger kids are also exposed to that, they get those same ideas without realizing, you know, there's a good five, four year gap between who they're seeing doing these things and who they themselves are. But now that they're copying, which, obviously, if you're exposed to something, and you like the idea, you're gonna adopt it as your own, there's less of that gap.

Jordan: And trying to fit in because they see it and they're like, “Oh, since they're doing it, that means I have to do it.” So even if what they're doing is not the right thing to do, they feel like they need to do it in order to fit in with everyone else around them and stuff like that.

Orelia: It's also like, when we had that kind of exposure to that kind of social media, we had parents filtering what we were seeing and how much time we were spending on it. But now with kids doing it, many times the parents are not even aware of the fact that they have those social media accounts, or they're lying to their parents about it and not telling them about it. So there's no filter to what they're watching or what they're getting exposed to.

Suhani: And the tricky part about social media is how much you can filter it. When we got social media at the beginning, I mean, five years does make a difference about how recent or how much information is already out there. So regardless of how many filters we were exposed to, there's only a certain amount of media that we can see. Whereas now there's like 20 times that, if not more. So there's such a huge variety of things that children can see and some of it's good, like Marcus said, and some of it's bad.

Orelia: And that’s the extent to which things are changing. Like they're getting exposed to more violent or explicit things than we were exposed to. If we were exposed to, on a scale from one to ten, if we were exposed to the 0.3 stuff, they get exposed to stuff that's equal to nine or ten.

Marcus: Yeah, I mean, I think to kind of take these ideas and form it into a thesis, I would definitely say that the growth of technology and how many, you know, connections there are exponentially increase as time goes on, right? So I think even though it has been, you know, five years, like, four, five, six years in between how we are behaving and how we're looking back. You know, you would say five years, and that's not a lot of time, but in terms of technology and the advancements and the amount of changes in internet culture that have happened. It's definitely not a reach to say that the landscape and technology and social media that we grew up with is completely different from how these younger kids are growing up. And you can be critical and say, “Oh, well, you're exaggerating it’s really only been four years.” But in four years, so much can change. Like, comparing internet culture now versus when I was in middle school, it's like night and day. Like, even just looking at stuff like the memes, right? Like memes back when I was in middle school were just slapstick jokes, and then now I'm looking at some of the memes and jokes that are being thrown around today and I don't even think I should be describing those jokes. But it's definitely, gosh, it's a completely different world from four years ago. It's four years. That's not a lot of time, but it's just so much has changed.

Suhani: So then other than social media, what other reasons could there be for, you know, some of these younger kids to be more mature than at least we remember being at that age, or, you know, knowing about these more mature topics.

Orelia: The environment that they're in, or like, what they're surrounded by, it's that as well. Stuff that goes on in their house or stuff that goes on in their friend's house and their friends tend to talk about it. Because at the end of the day, they are like 11, 12 year olds that are having to experience things that are not normal for them, or are hard to digest for them and they need to speak about it to other people. And when they do, your friends also get exposed to it and you don't know how many of them actually go home and tell their parents about it, to ask for help for them, even for their friends. So they're getting exposed to such kind of topics that they feel like, “Okay, all of this is going on with my friend, I need to help them out.” And they try to wrap their heads around it, and they read about it and understand from other people and then they just have a better idea about those kinds of topics.

Jordan: If we're talking about the environment, we also have to think about sometimes kids, they have to grow up faster. Like when it comes to taking care of your younger siblings or something, you need to be the more mature example for them. For instance, let's use an example. Let's say, parents, they work day and night, and they're not really home all the time. You're maybe like 13, and you have little siblings that are five or whatever. You have to be the so-called parent for them. Since their parents are working, you have to mature. Now they’re looking at you and they're gonna follow what you do, like follow in your footsteps. So you have to be the more mature example for them, which leads to the 13-year-old having to grow up a little faster than a normal 13-year-old should or would be.

Marcus: Speaking of 13-year-olds, someone brought this up a couple weeks ago, but looking back at the recent Olympics that happened. Some of those kids that were competing, like in the Olympics, like they're, like 12-13 years old, and they're on an Olympic stage. And that is commendable, right? Like you've achieved so much out there teen but is it really objectively better to have, you know, these kids being thrown into the world of adults at such a young age? Like is it objectively better to skip those couple of years where, you know, you would play outside and just have goofy, fun, ignorant, enjoyment with other peers your age. Some could maybe say that it's tragic, almost, that they've been kind of gypped of their childhood. But I guess it's all about how you see it. Because from one angle, well you're competing in the Olympics at the age of 13.

Suhani: I have to say, the thing about playing outside, I think that's how we remember our own childhoods. But if I think about my cousins who are like eight ish, right? And like elementary school, they're glued to their screens. So I think the whole childhood experience itself has been redefined. I don't know if my cousins go outside nearly as much as I did. I remember you know, going outside, actually, like picking up sticks and whatnot, you know, just like, like actually, you know, really doing random stuff because I had nothing else to do, you would see all the neighborhood kids out together because there was nothing to do at home. But now everyone has their own screen.

Jordan: Like the Ipad children.

Marcus: Like you see them out in public, and they have like, a leash backpack on them and they're like, on their crusty iPads with like, the big rubber case and they're watching Coco-Melon or something. But honestly, I think I can maybe pinpoint exactly when that transition happened, right? Because I don't want to sound like a conspiracy theorist but Fortnite. I sincerely think it's Fortnite that was the genesis of this, you know, difference in growing up right? Because I remember like, like you said, Suhani, I remember playing with sticks right? I remember some of my fondest memories in childhood were just walking out introducing myself to a random neighborhood kid and like throwing a stick at them. Or like climbing up a set of stairs, in my mind it was a really high set of stairs, but it was maybe like a foot up, and just jumping and then climbing back up and jumping off of it and pretending I could fly, right? And then Fortnite came around, right? And then we made that transition from, you know, playing outside with our neighborhood friends, to getting off the bus and saying, “Hey, do you wanna play Fortnite after school? Right? And then you could see the change in YouTube content, right? It went from more niche stuff to more, you know, daily “Let’s Play” content that you could definitely see a kid enjoying more, right? So I would say we, as you know, ‘04, ‘05, ‘03, you know, that kind of early 2000s timeframe, we were able to definitely get the benefit of, you know, the playing outside childhood and also growing up with technology, like almost a perfect balance. And now since technology is rapidly growing, these younger kids are growing up having less of that playing outside, and more of growing up in complete technology.

Jordan: Weird fun fact, when I was eight and my sister was four, we had a garage at this time, and my mom would take us outside to, you know, ride our bikes. We used to literally look for bugs on the ground, take our bubble gun and trap the bug in a bubble. Don't ask me why we did that. But we thought we were the most amazing, we thought we were part of John Wick or something, trapping bugs with bubbles. But now my sister stays in her room playing Roblox and I join her sometimes, but like, it's crazy to think that we used to go outside all the time. But I don't leave my house. Neither does she. She never leaves the house. And when she does leave the house, it’s to go to her friend's house. But then they end up playing like Minecraft, which they could have done if she wouldn’t have left. But they just changed.

Marcus: Let me just ask, is this a bad thing?

Suhani: Well, I don't know because my sister is, talking from experience obviously, is, you know, not this conventional younger kid that we're describing. She cannot sit still at home, like refuses to. In the summer, I remember when we first moved to Georgia, she actually rang a bunch of our neighbors doorbells and was like,”Hi, are there any kids here? Can I play with your kids?” because she just really wanted to make friends. And though we just moved, I think there's like 20 kids in my neighborhood, like, age ranging from my age to five year olds who know Ruhani. I am Ruhani’s sister, and they, you know, now come outside and play and they'll ring our doorbell and ask if she's available. So I think you know, it depends on who you are inherently.

Orelia: I was just thinking, how does this affect them? They weren't exposed to a portion of childhood that we were exposed to, like without technology. So how does that change, that when they grow up, when they are of our age or even older than us, when they go to that age, how is that going to affect the next generation? Just think that they've been exposed to more advancement in their childhood that they don't know this portion of childhood that we were a part of.

Marcus: Yeah, I mean, of course, when we say generations, we're talking about micro generations, right? Like, there is definitely a big generational gap between let's say, like millennials and Gen Z, and then even within Gen Z, they're micro generations like, early 2000s. and then late 2000s, or, like, early 2010s, right? There's a big difference in culture, right? So again, we are kind of young ourselves so we can't really say but I'm pretty sure if I were to, you know, throw a blind dart, I would definitely say that, with these next coming generations, rather than having a negative outlook like, you know, they haven't really experienced childhood, they've grown up fast. I think that with these younger kids that are coming along, right, you know, maybe we're when we're in college, when we're in college, looking back at upcoming middle schoolers, right? I don't know what will happen, right? But I definitely think that, at that point, technology will be advanced to such a point, you know, where maybe instead of playing outside with sticks, they'll be playing in virtual reality with sticks, right? So I think maybe that what we're looking at these middle schoolers now, it's kind of like the awkward phase where you know, it's right in between playing outside and right in between complete technological immersion, right?

Suhani: So it’s really transitionary.

Marcus: Oh, of course, that's what I think. Of course, I can't even tell you what will happen tomorrow, let alone in a couple years. I don't even know what will happen next period, right? So I don't know what's going to happen within these next couple of years.

Suhani: I mean, on top of that, you have to realize that we’re high schoolers. To some extent, we're also still kids talking about, you know, like a half generation difference of, you know, kids who are younger than us by five years. And we're evaluating their behavior and comparing it to us, though, you know, our parents consider us kids, probably people in their mid 20s honestly consider us kids. And sometimes I look around the school and also consider myself a kid.

Marcus: It’s really easy to take, like a critic's view and say, “Aren't we technically growing up too fast by taking these, you know, deep conversations about, you know, our own critiques on younger generations, like, is that not a form of growing up too fast?”

Orelia: Not really in my opinion, because we're just comparing something that we went through, and kids that see now, you know, they're not going through it, or they're going through it very differently. And because it's so induced by things that they're aware of, and most of us at our age we weren't, and in some ways, it's actually good, like, they're more aware of things, when they grow up, they most probably will have a better outlook and a more positive outlook towards things. But at the same time, they're getting more toned down and stressed out at this time, because of what they're exposed to.

Suhani: I think each generation will have its own, you know, different experiences and whatnot. I think it's just how you react to that, right? So these kids when they grow up, maybe they'll be talking about, “Yes, my childhood didn't really have a lot of going outside, but now I am, because I realized that that's something I want to do.” Maybe because they've only had one side of the spectrum, they’ll choose and they'll have that conscious decision making of, “No, I want something else.” We don't really know, right?

Marcus: But like, what is the spectrum, right? Of course, the definition of the two sides of the spectrum will constantly shift. Like what we think is, you know, again, like playing with sticks versus playing Roblox or Minecraft online. That's our spectrum, right? And in a couple years the spectrum might be, you know, oh, you're just playing Minecraft with your friends versus, you know, talking with them in VR chat or something. I'm not sure if you guys know what I’m talking about. It might be crazy to think that in five years, these middle schoolers that we're talking about might be sitting down and having the same conversation like, “Wow, these middle schoolers, they’re growing up way too fast”, right? Like, what if, five years ago, the high schoolers of then were looking at us as middle schoolers and saying, “Wow, these middle schoolers are growing up way too fast.” We're young, like you said, so I don't want to get ahead of myself. This conversation could be happening, you know, every couple years or so, right? Like maybe it's not just these younger kids. Maybe it was the same thing for us. Like maybe it was the same thing for the current college kids, right? Like I could definitely see us as maybe being a bit too reactionary in the way like, maybe this isn't the worst thing.

Suhani: Okay, but I mean, regardless, the people older than us, you know, kind of turned out okay. I'm sure we’ll turn out okay, in our own way. So regardless of what happens, I think everyone will find a way to cope or to fill in whatever gaps they recognize.

Jordan: I feel like it’s repetitive because even my older sister, she's in her 20s and She looks at me and tells me, “Oh, I didn't do that when I was 16. Oh, my friends didn't do that when we were 15.” Like each new generation is going to be, “Oh, we didn't do that. We didn't do that. We didn't do that”, like as time moves on- oh this sounds like a movie quote- as society grows and stuff like that.

Suhani: I think on that note, before we get too cynical, we should conclude the episode, so this concludes our Across the Table. Thank you so much for listening. For a transcript of this episode, head to the Point of View tab on our website, nhsmessenger.org and follow us on Instagram, Twitter or Facebook at @nhspointofview for updates and new episodes. We're your hosts Suhani, Marcus, Jordan, Orelia and this has been Point of View.

Point of You - High School Then and Now

Orelia Thottam, Marcus Kim

Point of View Host Marcus Kim speaks with teachers Mr. DeLong and Mrs. Pope about their high school experiences and how they compare to what they observe in their classrooms today. Listen on Spotify or Apple Music. 

Marcus Kim: Hello, and welcome to point of view where we give students a place to listen, learn and lean in. I'm your host, Marcus Kim, and today we'll be interviewing Mrs. Pope and Mr. DeLong about their high school experiences. So Mrs. Pope and Mr. DeLong- how are you today?

Mrs. Pope: Great! Thank you. How are you, Marcus?

Marcus Kim: Not so great. It's a day in school.

Mrs. Pope: Right! Yeah.

Marcus Kim: Yeah. See, unlike you guys, I don't get paid to be here.

Mrs. Pope: I don't know if you can say I'm paid.

Marcus Kim: Oh, this is this is very true. All right. So, of course, a lot of students kind of forget that teachers were once High Schoolers too. So, if you guys could describe your past high school selves in one phrase, what would it be?

Mr. Delong: I think mine would be quiet and reserved.

Mrs. Pope: And I'd say mine would be nerdy, but nerdy and in love with learning. I wanted to be at school. I wanted to learn. That was-

Marcus Kim: So you would wake up every day excited to go to school?

Mrs. Pope: Yeah, I was that little nerd that enjoyed just the activity of being here at school in the learning process.

Marcus Kim: Would you say that- so for those of you that don't know, Mr. DeLong, was actually a student of Mrs. Pope. So, Mr. DeLong, was there ever a day that you didn't want to go to Mrs. Pope's class?

Mr. Delong: Not for Mrs. Pope's class because her class was always very fun to be in. But there were definitely times in other classes that I would just not want to try.

Marcus Kim: And Mrs. Pope, you said that you enjoyed going to school every day. So were there any classes you didn't like?

Mrs. Pope: Um, you know, I think a lot of you will identify with this, that the first time I remember ever needing to leave a class because I needed to cry was math.

Marcus Kim: Oh, I see. I think a lot of Northview students can relate.

Mrs. Pope: I think a lot would identify with that. So that moment, that math moment, when I realized that the A's I had been achieving in math were crashing, and so I sort of reached my limit in my math experience.

Marcus Kim: So you went to high school in South Africa, and was there as like a specific teacher in your high school experience that made you decide, "Yeah, I want to be a teacher."

Mrs. Pope: Um, you know, it, I really want to be honest, I don't think it was a teacher. Funny enough, there was an elementary school teacher, my seventh grade teacher, she was really inspiring. But high school, not particularly, it was more college. If I go actually towards the college experience, which you guys are still going to experience, it's often the college professor who maybe has more creative freedom to really inspire you in a direction. Also, my parents both came from teaching environments. And so I grew up in the world of having parents who had taught and have been teachers and in a family that were teachers. So I think that was part of what inspired me more than actually the teachers in school.

Mr. Delong: Yeah, I mean, similar to me, son of two teachers. I would say in terms of teachers that Northview when I had, he's not here anymore, but Mr. Pfeiffer was my ninth-grade math teacher. And he was very eccentric and he also stuttered like me as well. And I don't meet a lot of people that stutter or like so like, blatantly, as I do from time to time, and it was different, but refreshing to see someone who was in this profession who could overcome that and sort of own it to a certain degree.

Marcus Kim: Right. Do you have any students like yourself that have stutters?

Mr. Delong: Not to my knowledge? No, I mean, some students will stutter but that's just from being nervous, not from like, just an innate inability to say something because of genetics.

Marcus Kim: Are there ever times where like, you see some of your own students and relate your past high school self to those students?

Mr. Delong: Yeah, I mean, I was pretty awkward at times and a lot of these kids can be pretty awkward too. I think being able to communicate with adults is very effective. And that's definitely something that like, I've learned to get better at and obviously, being an adult now too. But there are students who are very difficult to communicate with because they either can't make eye contact, they can't articulate their ideas in a way that I can understand them the way that they want me to. So that's things that I tried to pick up on and I will go out of my way to try to help them.

Marcus Kim: And Mrs. Pope. Um, well, you've been on this earth a little bit longer. So you- no offense- you do so what do you say you remember your high school? Like your high school experience fairly well?

Mrs. Pope: Um, you know, I do, I think we've got to remember, I think sometimes when you get caught up in the high school experience, you think this is the be-all and end-all. And you're really at the start of the journey of your life, you know, graduating high school is one tiny step and the full extent of what your life becomes. But hey, I remember particular moments, you know, like, like a time I failed math and realized that come to the end of my math journey, or like, like, making the first team for my field hockey team. So those were kind of moments where, you know, those academic moments? Meh. You don't remember, near as half as actually those social moments and the interactions you had with people that sort of cement that memory for you and make the high school experience you remember.

Marcus Kim: Yeah, and I've actually experienced three different high schools. And Mr. DeLong, as alumni from Northview, would you say that, from the time you graduated, was the cutthroat super strict, academic kind of environment the same?

Mr. Delong: Yeah, I mean, I think Northview has always been really competitive. I think also, Northview is very cliquey. I mean, I think we're very diverse, but like students have very set sets of friends. And I know that’s the same for all high schools, but I feel like Northview has it pretty severenstill. So like, students are very set on who they want to communicate with, and share ideas with and whatnot. And a lot of my friends are also former students of Northview and almost all of mine, I actually never talked to when I was a student here, it was after high school, in college, or just outside that, like those barriers kind of broke. But I feel like at Northview, there are very high barriers to be able to communicate outside of like your friend group.

Mrs. Pope: Just to add to what Jason is saying, I think, you know, it's funny, we want to say, you know, Northview has a lot cliques- every high school does- I think it's the nature of high school, the nature of being teenagers and, and university was a different experience. I think you break those boundaries, and you find bigger connections and deeper connections with people than you do at the high school level. I don't know if it's a safety aspect at high school, you're still discovering yourself and your identity and who you are, that creates these cliques that we find comfort with. We're not, we're forced into whatever the situation is.

Marcus Kim: Right. So, both of you as teachers at Northview, of course, Mr. DeLong, in Math and Mrs. Pope in English, you've definitely seen some students that are super, super stressed and getting perfect grades is their absolute number one priority. Now that you guys are adults, do you have a different retrospect and kind of a different view on life?

Mrs. Pope: I think, when I look back with my larger experience, a few more years on this earth, this perspective, you know, looking back, I think it's so hard because you get caught up in the high school experience, and I don't blame you. I mean, that's your narrow worldview at the moment and what you're feeling. So I think the stress is, is worse than possibly what your parents had? And you know what I'm going to say? I'm going to say yes. And I think for you to recognize a real sense of stress and to feel an extra pressure, I'm going to say yes. I feel like every generation almost demands of the next generation, a closer move to this perfect student and this perfect place. And there’s that, you know, if you're going to be successful, what job are you pursuing? And what career are you getting to to the point that we've lost sight of just being human beings in the moment and enjoying things in the moment? There's a real pressure to try and meet this outside expectation. And I don't think it's got lighter. I think it's gotten harder.

Mr. Delong: Yeah. I mean-

Mrs. Pope: I think, you know, what I'm gonna say, the more global we become, it's almost more like how do we meet the global competition? We're not even talking about local competition because you know, if you think back to your parents, often it was, where they went to school was where they were going to work and get their jobs, maybe not your parents, but your grandparents. Now, your work can take you anywhere in the world. But then who are you competing against? What does that look like? And when we're up against a world of more and more educated people, it's closing in on us.

Mr. Delong: It's a vicious cycle. My opinion has ever evolved about this pursuit of perfection. I think that because it's a vicious cycle, you're almost forced to. Where, like a lot of these college professors today couldn't be professors if they were students now, because like the barrier for entry is so much higher now. And I think the best way to combat burnout would be to just find the profession, find the job that like that, that you want to do. And I think if you can't, if you can find that route, then burnouts going to be a huge problem.

Marcus Kim: Oh yeah, I've seen amongst my peers a lot of burnout. And I see it basically any class I go to, right. Like, it might seem mean to say, but sometimes I see some of my friends have gray hairs from all the stress they've been under.

Mrs. Pope: And maybe it's not necessarily the pursuit of a career or finding out what it is that you want to do. Because there’s so much out there that we don't know what we want to do, but maybe your passion, you know, like that you can follow your passions, so that you're not being forced into things that are not you. And we know so many students that are being told, you know, you're going to have to follow this technology route or this business route, because that's where you're gonna find success. And then you're like, wait, I want to draw pretty postcards and send those to my friends. Yeah.

Marcus Kim: Yeah definitely, because a lot of people or a lot of my peers are like, oh, yeah, I need to do so well, to prepare me to get into a good college, right, and to then get a good job. So then an interesting narrative comes up, where it's: are you truly preparing yourself for life after high school by studying immensely and always being so absorbed in academia?

Mrs. Pope: No! Um, and, you know, it depends on who you are, like, I think you've got to find that, that route of academia that inspires you and moves you, you know, I love reading great essays. And, you know, with AP lang experience, all of the grades, right? And the great writing that’s out there, I love that pursuit of academia, but I'm not going to sit and learn how to code. I think you've got to decide what it is that, that you like, the most, and, and to put yourself out in that direction.

Mr. Delong: It's, it's a balance, it's a balance thing. But I've definitely seen people that have changed their lives from purely moving to academics, where they didn't, they didn't have a direction in life. And they sat down and they taught and like, they taught themselves coding, or they, you know, they did the work. And, you know, I think, you know, there comes a time when being a college kid is fun, but then you got to start paying the bills. And it's like, yeah, I did an art major, but that's not gonna, you know, pay for my rent or pay for my water, so.

Marcus Kim: So it's all about the balance, right?

Mr. Delong: Yeah, the balance and I think the practicality of just, not anything you do will work. It has to be lucky or pick a business major. Yeah, they make a lot of money.

Marcus Kim: All right. Well, thank you so much for your time here. I'll let you guys get back to your classes so you can teach the future generation of America or other countries, who knows, but thank you so much for your time.

Mrs. Pope: Well, Marcus, anytime.

Marcus Kim: This concludes our talk with Mrs. Pope and Mr. DeLong thank you so much for listening. For a transcript of this episode had to the NHS Point of View tab on our website nhsmessenger.org and follow us on Instagram, Twitter and Facebook @nhspointofview for updates and new episodes. I'm your host, Marcus Kim, and this has been Point of View.

News Flash - Homecoming Titans

Rachel Everett, Orelia Thottam, Grace Yang

Point of View host, Grace Yang, sits down with Northview's 2021 Homecoming Titans and Student Council President and VP to discuss the new title of Homecoming Titans. Listen on Spotify here!

Grace: Hello and welcome to Point of View where we give students a place to listen,, learn and lean in, I'm your host Grace Yang and today I'll be talking about the brand new title of homecoming titans; how the idea formed, and its impact on the school and the student body.

[Crowd Cheering] 

Grace: Every modern American high school student or alumni is familiar with the titles of Homecoming Queen and King. This is typically the selection of two students in the senior class, previously male and female, to represent the school at the homecoming dance. The key words there are male and female. 

Grace: With our growing and changing society, male and female are not the only accepted genders. There are people who identify as transgender, non-binary and even more. Having a homecoming queen and king cannot encompass and accurately represent schools anymore. 

Grace: Returning to school after nearly two years of remote learning, new opportunities are flowing in. It is a perfect time for new traditions and changes within schools. It ties in as well into Northview’s 20th-anniversary celebration. As we celebrate the past, we can create new traditions to replace those that might be outdated or obsolete. 

Grace: In addition to many other things, a more recent change was the new title of Homecoming Titans. Inspiration for the change in title was Northview’s diverse student body. As many of us know, Northview has many different cultures, which are highlighted in different events. Bringing this diversity into the homecoming court was an important factor to President Kelly Jeong and Vice President Jessica Kim. 

Kelly: The reasoning behind this change was that especially because of this rise in inclusivity, in social media, that was where the idea first originated. And because we want to keep this environment, this inclusive environment in Northview, which is what we are known for this diversity and inclusivity. at large, we also wanted to seep this into the student council decision making as well.

Jeong and Kim brought this proposition to student council members during a council meeting. This decision was important for them and had to be decided quickly before the homecoming season. They figured that the term Titan would best encompass everyone at Northview.

Jessica: In one of our meetings, we had voting among the student council members, and they are the representatives of their class, and our entire school. So we wanted them to predict the responses from the students and not just think, with their, with what they just think, but what their whole class would think and represent their voices. So we didn't consult with the other people outside of student council, when making the decision, but I believe that the student council as a whole was representative of the entire school.

Grace: While the overall response to the change was good there were of course varying responses and opinions. After the council meeting, the change was released to the entire school and the response was similar to the student council. The response was a positive one. 

Grace: There was also another change in the homecoming court. In previous years, only seniors were permitted to vote both male and female students onto the court.. All of the other grades were open only to female students. In contrast, this year, the court was open to anyone. Any and all students could be nominated, regardless of gender. . It was simply the people with the most votes.

Grace: This same voting system was used to decide the Homecoming Titans. The two homecoming titans would be the people with the most votes. It wouldn’t matter if it was two people of the same gender or two different genders. 

Grace: It just so happened that this year’s homecoming was a male, TJ James, and a female, Holyn Trautwein. These two winners were selected because they wholeheartedly embody what Northview is and what it represents. 

Grace: James and Trautwein were the inaugural homecoming titans. Both of them were very excited to be crowned homecoming titans and lead in creating a more inclusive space for people who do not identify as male or female. 

Holly: I really like how we're becoming more inclusive as a high school and I know some high schoolers still trying to become more inclusive. So I think we're like leading in that,” James said. They’re not just leading inside Northview but also for other schools in the area. “I think Northview is the only school I've ever heard of so far that's been using like Titans instead of king and queen. Like named for the role, which I think is really cool. Because again, it's like accepting of others and inclusive to everyone. And I think that's a really big step that I'm kind of proud of Northview for taking.  

Grace: This new step for Northview is due to the desire to create a more inclusive space. In addition to the Homecoming title change, Northview has created a new pledge committee in order to increase inclusivity and promote diversity. One of the Northview United leaders, Tania Pope, even selected James to be on the student portion of the committee. 

TJ: I'm actually a member of Northview United, I was recruited by I think Miss Pope was the one who invited me to join the team. So I think it's really important that we do have Northview United here at Northview. Because ours we have a diverse student body. But that doesn't mean that we know how to handle diversity appropriately, especially with like everything going on in like current events, and all that. So I think that Northview, I mean, Northview united is really helping us be able to learn how to take both, like consider cultures as perspectives, and respect them, and maybe like implement them in our lives if they work for certain situations.  

Grace: Even for students outside of Northview united, it provides an example to learn more about diversity and how to handle it appropriately. Trautwein shares how she sees Northview United from a student perspective. 

Holly: I think it's kind of a learning opportunity for everybody to see how to kind of, like, consider others and learn about other diversities. And just like, again, like what he said, with all the current events going on, I think it's really important to have this thing that educates us and helps us learn how to react to certain things.

Grace: While a simple homecoming title change can be impactful, Northview itself is also a place that leaves a lasting effect on everyone. Through its diversity and effort to be inclusive, it creates a strong safe environment. It also leaves an impression on the students. Including studying and hanging out and through events like international night, students are able to learn about varying cultures and learn how to navigate through an ever-diversifying world. 

Holly: I think the level of diversity here has helped me understand like, different kind of backgrounds, like those around me, who are some of my best friends like I never would have really known if I hadn't had Northview to bring us together. So I think really like broaden my knowledge of diversity and like cultures and stuff.

Grace: Despite the change in homecoming tradition, Northview students are embracing Student Council’s efforts to create a safe space for all students and present new opportunities for change. 

Grace: This concludes this episode of News Flash. Thank you so much for listening - For a transcript of this episode, head to the Point of View tab on our website nhsmessenger.org& follow us on Instagram, Twitter and Facebook at @nhspointview for updates and new episodes. I'm your host Grace Yang and this has been point of view.